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Post by Harrier on Jun 13, 2016 14:06:33 GMT -5
Fuckin coward bastard gutless russian fucks. Most of their attacks where on normal football fans not the English hooligans. Fuckers waited until tear gas was fired at England fans to go in and pick their targets at will, normal people havin a beer. In the stadium it was full of women, children and normal football fans. Now there's bad blood for the World Cup in Russia in18.
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Post by Raoul Duke on Jun 14, 2016 3:42:17 GMT -5
First sentences have been handed out with prison. A French dude got 1 year in prison for rioting in Marseille. 5 English jailed and not one Russian ultra detained. Disgusting. From everything I've read these guys are All Star thugs. Small very mobile groups, well organized. Go in, pound a dude to a pulp an leave in 30 seconds. I've read many different articles and since I don't know jack about managing huge borderline crowds like this, I don't know where the truth lies. Did the French cops missmanage the whole situation? Some say our tactics are ancient history: it's either let them break shit or go in and crack skulls. No middle ground, no de-escalating. Do other cops do it differnetly? Maybe 32Green can shed some of his experience. I do know French cops were traumatized during the world cup here in 98 when one cop got isolated from his group and got badly beaten by hooligans and is now a vegetable. So I think it's in the collective minds "stay together, don't leave the pack", which doesn't mesh well with having to be really mobile and cover an entire city in order to catch the small packs of dooshbags. Another factor is French cops are on the verge of burnout. Since the attacks they have been all out, knocking down doors. The country is still in a state of emergency, means more patrols, more everything; Plus there were major strikes and confrontations with extreme leftists right before the Euro. All vacations or rest time were cancelled for the Euro. Anyone who has a badge is in the streets today. I'm sure there is some form of mental exhaustion. "Fuck it, if these dudes want to kill each other over football..". Dunno. Frankly I'm surprised one hasn't snapped and sent a dude to the morgue yet.
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Post by Raoul Duke on Jun 14, 2016 3:50:04 GMT -5
Didn't seee the game last night.
Sucks that Italy won. Always seem on the brink of failure, and always pull through.
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Post by Harrier on Jun 14, 2016 4:28:26 GMT -5
5 English jailed and not one Russian ultra detained. Disgusting. From everything I've read these guys are All Star thugs. Small very mobile groups, well organized. Go in, pound a dude to a pulp an leave in 30 seconds. I've read many different articles and since I don't know jack about managing huge borderline crowds like this, I don't know here the truth lies. Did the French cops missmanage the whole situation? Some say our tactics are ancient history: it's either let them break shit or go in and crack skulls. No middle ground, no de-escalating. Do other cops do it differnetly? Maybe 32Green can shed some of his experience. I do know French cops were traumatized during the world cup here in 98 when one cop got isolated from his group and got badly beaten by hooligans and is now a vegetable. So I think it's in the collective minds "stay together, don't leave the pack", which doesn't mesh well with having to be really mobile and cover an entire city in order to catch the small packs of dooshbags. Another factor is French cops are on the verge of burnout. Since the attacks they have been all out, knocking down doors. The country is still in a state of emergency, means more patrols, more everything; Plus there were major strikes and confrontations with extreme leftists right before the Euro. All vacations or rest time were cancelled for the Euro. Anyone who has a badge is in the streets today. I'm sure there is some form of mental exhaustion. "Fuck it, if these dudes want to kill each other of football..". Dunno. Frankly I'm surprised one hasn't snapped and sent a dude to the morgue yet. I sympathise with the authorities I really do, especially given how stretched they are due to the threat of terrorism, however the bare-minimum police should be able to offer is the security for the average fan in the stadium, the lack of segregation and police presence in the stadium was an absolute joke. In the U.K we have riot police like you but we have a heavy presence of undercover police mingled in with the fans to spot potential flash points and detain before it escalates, less man power better results. Now to these Russian fuckers.....No respect for guys who ambush and beat a guy senseless 10 on 1 but run away when the numbers are equal. Cowards.
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Post by Raoul Duke on Jun 14, 2016 4:39:03 GMT -5
From everything I've read these guys are All Star thugs. Small very mobile groups, well organized. Go in, pound a dude to a pulp an leave in 30 seconds. I've read many different articles and since I don't know jack about managing huge borderline crowds like this, I don't know here the truth lies. Did the French cops missmanage the whole situation? Some say our tactics are ancient history: it's either let them break shit or go in and crack skulls. No middle ground, no de-escalating. Do other cops do it differnetly? Maybe 32Green can shed some of his experience. I do know French cops were traumatized during the world cup here in 98 when one cop got isolated from his group and got badly beaten by hooligans and is now a vegetable. So I think it's in the collective minds "stay together, don't leave the pack", which doesn't mesh well with having to be really mobile and cover an entire city in order to catch the small packs of dooshbags. Another factor is French cops are on the verge of burnout. Since the attacks they have been all out, knocking down doors. The country is still in a state of emergency, means more patrols, more everything; Plus there were major strikes and confrontations with extreme leftists right before the Euro. All vacations or rest time were cancelled for the Euro. Anyone who has a badge is in the streets today. I'm sure there is some form of mental exhaustion. "Fuck it, if these dudes want to kill each other of football..". Dunno. Frankly I'm surprised one hasn't snapped and sent a dude to the morgue yet. I sympathise with the authorities I really do, especially given how stretched they are due to the threat of terrorism, however the bare-minimum police should be able to offer is the security for the average fan in the stadium, the lack of segregation and police presence in the stadium was an absolute joke. In the U.K we have riot police like you but we have a heavy presence of undercover police mingled in with the fans to spot potential flash points and detain before it escalates, less man power better results. Now to these Russian fuckers.....No respect for guys who ambush and beat a guy senseless 10 on 1 but run away when the numbers are equal. Cowards. Yeah maybe we lack the undercover guys mixed in with the fans. Have no idea why some sort of european cooperation wasn't in place. Use English cops mixed in with English fans, German cops with German fans...etc. If we can't pull off simple shit like that, no wonder terrorists can circulate freely in Europe.
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Post by Harrier on Jun 14, 2016 5:21:48 GMT -5
I sympathise with the authorities I really do, especially given how stretched they are due to the threat of terrorism, however the bare-minimum police should be able to offer is the security for the average fan in the stadium, the lack of segregation and police presence in the stadium was an absolute joke. In the U.K we have riot police like you but we have a heavy presence of undercover police mingled in with the fans to spot potential flash points and detain before it escalates, less man power better results. Now to these Russian fuckers.....No respect for guys who ambush and beat a guy senseless 10 on 1 but run away when the numbers are equal. Cowards. Yeah maybe we lack the undercover guys mixed in with the fans. Have no idea why some sort of european cooperation wasn't in place. Use English cops mixed in with English fans, German cops with German fans...etc. If we can't pull off simple shit like that, no wonder terrorists can circulate freely in Europe. Hasn't a French officer just been killed in another attack? Just beyond belief Europe is rioting over football when shit like this is happening. Green will just say it would not happen if we had guns, yes there's been 5 days of graphic violence using weapons and fists but at least no one was killed, meanwhile one but job with a gun takes out 50 people in one swing.
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Post by Raoul Duke on Jun 14, 2016 6:00:14 GMT -5
Yeah maybe we lack the undercover guys mixed in with the fans. Have no idea why some sort of european cooperation wasn't in place. Use English cops mixed in with English fans, German cops with German fans...etc. If we can't pull off simple shit like that, no wonder terrorists can circulate freely in Europe. Hasn't a French officer just been killed in another attack? Just beyond belief Europe is rioting over football when shit like this is happening. Green will just say it would not happen if we had guns, yes there's been 5 days of graphic violence using weapons and fists but at least no one was killed, meanwhile one but job with a gun takes out 50 people in one swing. Yeah last night in his home with wife. Calling it a terrorist attack... I'm sure there's a lot more thought and tactics that go into managing big crowds than we're aware of.
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Post by 32Green on Jun 14, 2016 7:47:16 GMT -5
5 English jailed and not one Russian ultra detained. Disgusting. From everything I've read these guys are All Star thugs. Small very mobile groups, well organized. Go in, pound a dude to a pulp an leave in 30 seconds. I've read many different articles and since I don't know jack about managing huge borderline crowds like this, I don't know where the truth lies. Did the French cops missmanage the whole situation? Some say our tactics are ancient history: it's either let them break shit or go in and crack skulls. No middle ground, no de-escalating. Do other cops do it differnetly? Maybe 32Green can shed some of his experience. I do know French cops were traumatized during the world cup here in 98 when one cop got isolated from his group and got badly beaten by hooligans and is now a vegetable. So I think it's in the collective minds "stay together, don't leave the pack", which doesn't mesh well with having to be really mobile and cover an entire city in order to catch the small packs of dooshbags. Another factor is French cops are on the verge of burnout. Since the attacks they have been all out, knocking down doors. The country is still in a state of emergency, means more patrols, more everything; Plus there were major strikes and confrontations with extreme leftists right before the Euro. All vacations or rest time were cancelled for the Euro. Anyone who has a badge is in the streets today. I'm sure there is some form of mental exhaustion. "Fuck it, if these dudes want to kill each other over football..". Dunno. Frankly I'm surprised one hasn't snapped and sent a dude to the morgue yet. Dukey, I would say our training is mostly done for police/crowd adversarial situations where there are defined crowds facing off against us. When you have mobile crowds of interspersed fans throughout a large geographical area turning on eachother, its almost impossible to control without sacrificing Officer safety (as in the vegetable scenario you mentioned). We used to have City wide teams called "Task Forces" that were boro-based and specifically trained to respond to rapidly developing situations and especially with crowd control. They werent tied to the radio answering routine calls for service like the rest of us so when the shyte hit the fan, they descended on scenes and quickly deployed. I think that has changed post-9/11 and their responsibilities and names have changed, geared more towards anti-terrorism shows of force (window dressing, imho). When we had the World Economic Summit and all the trust fund kids who always wanted to riot and fvck the police descended on NYC, we threw sheer numbers at them; Thousands of cops, multiple check points at any perceived target, the use of under-cover's to glean intelligence. It worked. When you have thousands of inter-mingled, drunken, wandering fans and a burnt-out, besieged, under-manned, under-trained cawps to handle it....I dont know what the solution is. It literally becomes a damned if you do...and damned if you dont, scenario. Now this news of the Police Commander and his wife being executed by a Muslim savage...when does it all become too much? You can almost understand how Nazi's...and people like Trump... can gain traction with a besieged populace.
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Post by Raoul Duke on Jun 14, 2016 7:56:38 GMT -5
From everything I've read these guys are All Star thugs. Small very mobile groups, well organized. Go in, pound a dude to a pulp an leave in 30 seconds. I've read many different articles and since I don't know jack about managing huge borderline crowds like this, I don't know where the truth lies. Did the French cops missmanage the whole situation? Some say our tactics are ancient history: it's either let them break shit or go in and crack skulls. No middle ground, no de-escalating. Do other cops do it differnetly? Maybe 32Green can shed some of his experience. I do know French cops were traumatized during the world cup here in 98 when one cop got isolated from his group and got badly beaten by hooligans and is now a vegetable. So I think it's in the collective minds "stay together, don't leave the pack", which doesn't mesh well with having to be really mobile and cover an entire city in order to catch the small packs of dooshbags. Another factor is French cops are on the verge of burnout. Since the attacks they have been all out, knocking down doors. The country is still in a state of emergency, means more patrols, more everything; Plus there were major strikes and confrontations with extreme leftists right before the Euro. All vacations or rest time were cancelled for the Euro. Anyone who has a badge is in the streets today. I'm sure there is some form of mental exhaustion. "Fuck it, if these dudes want to kill each other over football..". Dunno. Frankly I'm surprised one hasn't snapped and sent a dude to the morgue yet. Dukey, I would say our training is mostly done for police/crowd adversarial situations where there are defined crowds facing off against us. When you have mobile crowds of interspersed fans throughout a large geographical area turning on eachother, its almost impossible to control without sacrificing Officer safety (as in the vegetable scenario you mentioned). I think this sums it up. Unless you're able to herd them into designated areas so as to not interract, if one side wants to starts some shit, it'll happen.
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Post by Ff2 on Jun 14, 2016 7:58:36 GMT -5
From everything I've read these guys are All Star thugs. Small very mobile groups, well organized. Go in, pound a dude to a pulp an leave in 30 seconds. I've read many different articles and since I don't know jack about managing huge borderline crowds like this, I don't know where the truth lies. Did the French cops missmanage the whole situation? Some say our tactics are ancient history: it's either let them break shit or go in and crack skulls. No middle ground, no de-escalating. Do other cops do it differnetly? Maybe 32Green can shed some of his experience. I do know French cops were traumatized during the world cup here in 98 when one cop got isolated from his group and got badly beaten by hooligans and is now a vegetable. So I think it's in the collective minds "stay together, don't leave the pack", which doesn't mesh well with having to be really mobile and cover an entire city in order to catch the small packs of dooshbags. Another factor is French cops are on the verge of burnout. Since the attacks they have been all out, knocking down doors. The country is still in a state of emergency, means more patrols, more everything; Plus there were major strikes and confrontations with extreme leftists right before the Euro. All vacations or rest time were cancelled for the Euro. Anyone who has a badge is in the streets today. I'm sure there is some form of mental exhaustion. "Fuck it, if these dudes want to kill each other over football..". Dunno. Frankly I'm surprised one hasn't snapped and sent a dude to the morgue yet. Dukey, I would say our training is mostly done for police/crowd adversarial situations where there are defined crowds facing off against us. When you have mobile crowds of interspersed fans throughout a large geographical area turning on eachother, its almost impossible to control without sacrificing Officer safety (as in the vegetable scenario you mentioned). We used to have City wide teams called "Task Forces" that were boro-based and specifically trained to respond to rapidly developing situations and especially with crowd control. They werent tied to the radio answering routine calls for service like the rest of us so when the shyte hit the fan, they descended on scenes and quickly deployed. I think that has changed post-9/11 and their responsibilities and names have changed, geared more towards anti-terrorism shows of force (window dressing, imho). When we had the World Economic Summit and all the trust fund kids who always wanted to riot and fvck the police descended on NYC, we threw sheer numbers at them; Thousands of cops, multiple check points at any perceived target, the use of under-cover's to glean intelligence. It worked. When you have thousands of inter-mingled, drunken, wandering fans and a burnt-out, besieged, under-manned, under-trained cawps to handle it....I dont know what the solution is. It literally becomes a damned if you do...and damned if you dont, scenario. Now this news of the Police Commander and his wife being executed by a Muslim savage...when does it all become too much? You can almost understand how Nazi's...and people like Trump... can gain traction with a besieged populace. Oh so you're saying trump is hitler? just kidding, interesting cawp stuff (for once). From a laymen's point of view, the show of force always seems to do the trick. Once morons start, things snowball. I once was in a crowd that was dead set on getting into a Rolling Stones concert. Someone had n inside guy who opened a side door. There were 2 cops there and I wa sure numbers would prevail. Instead, the officer cracked the skull of the first kid who disobeyed his command. That ended that.
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Post by 32Green on Jun 14, 2016 8:27:07 GMT -5
Dukey, I would say our training is mostly done for police/crowd adversarial situations where there are defined crowds facing off against us. When you have mobile crowds of interspersed fans throughout a large geographical area turning on eachother, its almost impossible to control without sacrificing Officer safety (as in the vegetable scenario you mentioned). We used to have City wide teams called "Task Forces" that were boro-based and specifically trained to respond to rapidly developing situations and especially with crowd control. They werent tied to the radio answering routine calls for service like the rest of us so when the shyte hit the fan, they descended on scenes and quickly deployed. I think that has changed post-9/11 and their responsibilities and names have changed, geared more towards anti-terrorism shows of force (window dressing, imho). When we had the World Economic Summit and all the trust fund kids who always wanted to riot and fvck the police descended on NYC, we threw sheer numbers at them; Thousands of cops, multiple check points at any perceived target, the use of under-cover's to glean intelligence. It worked. When you have thousands of inter-mingled, drunken, wandering fans and a burnt-out, besieged, under-manned, under-trained cawps to handle it....I dont know what the solution is. It literally becomes a damned if you do...and damned if you dont, scenario. Now this news of the Police Commander and his wife being executed by a Muslim savage...when does it all become too much? You can almost understand how Nazi's...and people like Trump... can gain traction with a besieged populace. Instead, the officer cracked the skull of the first kid who disobeyed his command. That ended that. That same cawp today, would have been filmed by 8 different Iphones and his skull-cracking downloaded onto social media within seconds...and he would be arrested, charged with Felony Assault...and sent to jail. Any cawp even stopping to ask a street vendor to move his stuff in Manhattan today, when he looks around, will find 5-6 or more people slowing down and reaching for their phones. The civilians are thinking "mebbe I'll film something good". The cawp is thinking..what are they reaching for... I know people find it hard to believe, but alot of guys and gals actually want to make a difference as cawps, but the pols, racial arsonists and media have made it an absolute liability to be pro-active. The worst kept secret in Civil Service is that you can do absolutely nothing your whole career...and still get paid. I saw it first hand. The ones who cared, put themselves in harms way, were pro-active...we buried plenty of them or watched them get jammed up, arrested or fired. I went from College into the PD because of a sh1tty economy when I graduated. If my son (who is going into his Sophomore year in College) ever told me he wanted to be a cawp..it would literally break my heart.
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Post by Ff2 on Jun 14, 2016 8:40:07 GMT -5
Instead, the officer cracked the skull of the first kid who disobeyed his command. That ended that. That same cawp today, would have been filmed by 8 different Iphones and his skull-cracking downloaded onto social media within seconds...and he would be arrested, charged with Felony Assault...and sent to jail. Any cawp even stopping to ask a street vendor to move his stuff in Manhattan today, when he looks around, will find 5-6 or more people slowing down and reaching for their phones. The civilians are thinking "mebbe I'll film something good". The cawp is thinking..what are they reaching for... I know people find it hard to believe, but alot of guys and gals actually want to make a difference as cawps, but the pols, racial arsonists and media have made it an absolute liability to be pro-active. The worst kept secret in Civil Service is that you can do absolutely nothing your whole career...and still get paid. I saw it first hand. The ones who cared, put themselves in harms way, were pro-active...we buried plenty of them or watched them get jammed up, arrested or fired. I went from College into the PD because of a sh1tty economy when I graduated. If my son (who is going into his Sophomore year in College) ever told me he wanted to be a cawp..it would literally break my heart. Yeah I was thinking the same thing about what would happen today. Little Jimmy's parents would be on the News within 10 minutes defending the poor kid. His Go Fund Me would get $240,000 in a day. Gone are the days when a trip to the basement at your local PD would be enough to dissuade young miscreants from a life of mischievous deeds. Scared straight? No one is scared anymore. Nice use of "racial arsonist" btw, thats new one to me.
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Post by exit9jetsfan on Jun 14, 2016 21:30:43 GMT -5
5 English jailed and not one Russian ultra detained. Disgusting. From everything I've read these guys are All Star thugs. Small very mobile groups, well organized. Go in, pound a dude to a pulp an leave in 30 seconds. I've read many different articles and since I don't know jack about managing huge borderline crowds like this, I don't know where the truth lies. Did the French cops missmanage the whole situation? Some say our tactics are ancient history: it's either let them break shit or go in and crack skulls. No middle ground, no de-escalating. Do other cops do it differnetly? Maybe 32Green can shed some of his experience. I do know French cops were traumatized during the world cup here in 98 when one cop got isolated from his group and got badly beaten by hooligans and is now a vegetable. So I think it's in the collective minds "stay together, don't leave the pack", which doesn't mesh well with having to be really mobile and cover an entire city in order to catch the small packs of dooshbags. Another factor is French cops are on the verge of burnout. Since the attacks they have been all out, knocking down doors. The country is still in a state of emergency, means more patrols, more everything; Plus there were major strikes and confrontations with extreme leftists right before the Euro. All vacations or rest time were cancelled for the Euro. Anyone who has a badge is in the streets today. I'm sure there is some form of mental exhaustion. "Fuck it, if these dudes want to kill each other over football..". Dunno. Frankly I'm surprised one hasn't snapped and sent a dude to the morgue yet. Typical fucking russian cowards, attacking as a group, kicking the man in the head when he's already down on the ground. Animals.
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Post by 32Green on Jun 14, 2016 22:28:43 GMT -5
Might be time to end these International tourney's in Europe, no? All this for a game where a punch of pvssies flop and fake injuries between 1-3 goals.... tops? Its divisive..not uniting...and during a time where the Islamic invasion of Europe is in full stealth-march.
Cant pretend the world is what it was. It aint.
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Post by Harrier on Jun 15, 2016 2:33:24 GMT -5
Might be time to end these International tourney's in Europe, no? All this for a game where a punch of pvssies flop and fake injuries between 1-3 goals.... tops? Its divisive..not uniting...and during a time where the Islamic invasion of Europe is in full stealth-march. Cant pretend the world is what it was. It aint. This has been goin on for 30+ years and it's not about the game on the field. England's hooligans are considered number 1 in the world and the Russians want that title, england have 4K who are banned from travelling to France and the Russians see a window of opportunity. England where caught totally unprepared for a bunch of armed MMA style russian fighters who ambush in small groups and then get on their toes when the numbers are even. Our fans where out of line for rioting in marseille on days 1 and 2 but they have done a good job standing up to these Russian bastards and their filthy ambush tactics.
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