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Post by MDL JET on Mar 22, 2017 9:58:40 GMT -5
What's the value in going with defense over building an offense and building around our young QBs?
This offense doesn't pose any threats in any way IMO. Love Powell but you don't have to stay up at night because of him. Decker is best in the slot and Enunwa and Anderson are solid, but aren't exactly scaring me on the outside. The rest are TBD.
And TE...? I don't even know who we have aside from the oft injured suspended ASJ.
This offense has no one that demands attention. If guys like Howard/Williams/Cook etc are available, why even think Defense?
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Post by Paradis on Mar 23, 2017 10:11:32 GMT -5
cause some people subscribe to a belief that a system and QB can make fair to good players great... Or functional at least.... where as they seek out playmakers and game changers on defense. They want a Von Miller, Kris Jenkins and Revis manning the defense, in exchange for building a bunch of Troy Browns and Branches around a Brady.
It's not a great argument, but that's the argument that exists. Also -- it's a function of how much attention and exposure offensive players get. It psychologically tweaks decision makers into thinking that these round 5 guys are legit, or that Quinton Patton is name. They don't have a fucking clue who that corner from middle Tennessee is but they sure have heard of that running back from south florida. His youtube videos are for real. So they draft Dee Milliner from bama in the first, and take Jalen Saunders in the 4th. because skillz.
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Post by peppep on Mar 23, 2017 11:26:36 GMT -5
Well, one reason is that a defensive player may be the clear BPA.
If you are rebuilding, and you have holes all over the place, you go BPA early in the first round. That's the philosophy of a lot of GMs.
And frankly, I'm not very high on M.Williams as high at 6th overall. His lack of elite speed and refined route running concerns me. And for all the talk about his catch radius, at 6'3, 205, he's not exactly the type of WR that can dominate NFL CBs purely on strength and size, like, for example M.Evans, who is 6'5 225 and ran a better 40. Just saying...
OJ Howard and Fournette, if they are all they are being hyped up to be (and I do believe they are) would be better options if the Jets were to go offense at 6.
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Post by Paradis on Mar 23, 2017 11:40:14 GMT -5
OJ Howard and Fournette, if they are all they are being hyped up to be (and I do believe they are) would be better options if the Jets were to go offense at 6. Since we're digressing -- Why is howard that good? I'm taking a contrarian position here, but why is he more Gronk than Gholston? |
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Post by peppep on Mar 23, 2017 11:48:38 GMT -5
OJ Howard and Fournette, if they are all they are being hyped up to be (and I do believe they are) would be better options if the Jets were to go offense at 6. Since we're digressing -- Why is howard that good? I'm taking a contrarian position here, but why is he more Gronk than Gholston? LOL, b/c he is. I mean, he has the size, speed, athleticism, etc. etc. and so on. Many believe he was underutilized at Alabama. Yet he still made big plays in the championship game, under the bright lights, when everything is on the line. And word is he has worked on and improved his blocking, which is what makes him more of a complete TE that can stay on the field for all 3 downs. Most scouts look at him as full of untapped potential. I believe Fournette is simply a special talent that does not come around very often. |
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Post by Paradis on Mar 23, 2017 11:50:50 GMT -5
Since we're digressing -- Why is howard that good? I'm taking a contrarian position here, but why is he more Gronk than Gholston? LOL, b/c he is. I mean, he has the size, speed, athleticism, etc. etc. and so on. Sounds like Gholston? "untapped potential" is right. I agree... but are we in the habit of spending a top 10 pick on untapped potential? Because on production/game tape -- there's only handful of meaningful games -- and huge stretches of nothing over the years. |
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Post by Touchable on Mar 23, 2017 11:56:30 GMT -5
There are only 2 defensive players I would draft at #6 as things stand...Myles Garrett (snowballs chance in hell he's there) and Jamal Adams (looking more and more unlikely he's there).
Otherwise...it's all about Fournette/Howard.
I think Lattimore is the best CB in the draft, but I'm not taking a guy with chronic hamstring issues that high in an absolutely stacked DB class.
Would rather add an offensive playmaker at #6 and then you could still possibly grab a Fabian Moreau, Adoree Jackson or Chidobe Awuzie at #39.
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Post by Sonny Werblin on Mar 26, 2017 10:48:56 GMT -5
Building a perennial winner 101.
Step 1 - build a dominant D. Why? Because it is a far easier task than building a dominant O. Great Ds are built on overall talent and scheme. It is not overly dependent on 1 position, like the O is with QB.
Step 2 - build an O-line. Can't function on O without one.
Step 3 -
find your franchise or near franchise level QB. Unless you're the Colts who have gone almost seamlessly from Unitas to Jones to Manning to Luck, this is a difficult task. Just ask every pats coach and GM before Brady showed up.
Step 4 - build an offensive scheme with skill players that cater to your QBs strength.
You can skip around steps when opportunities present themselves, but this is the general road map for success in the NFL.
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Post by chrebet80 on Mar 27, 2017 18:48:31 GMT -5
Building a perennial winner 101. Step 1 - build a dominant D. Why? Because it is a far easier task than building a dominant O. Great Ds are built on overall talent and scheme. It is not overly dependent on 1 position, like the O is with QB. Step 2 - build an O-line. Can't function on O without one. Step 3 - find your franchise or near franchise level QB. Unless you're the Colts who have gone almost seamlessly from Unitas to Jones to Manning to Luck, this is a difficult task. Just ask every pats coach and GM before Brady showed up. Step 4 - build an offensive scheme with skill players that cater to your QBs strength. You can skip around steps when opportunities present themselves, but this is the general road map for success in the NFL. I agree with all of that but we have used many 1st rounders on defense the past 10 years and still have an average defense at best. Many of these picks have been busts. (gholston, Kyle Burnt Toast Wilson, quinton coples, Calvin pryor) some have been hits. (Wilkerson, williams) the jury is still out on Lee. And Sheldon is a fucking nut job. By going defense in the 1st rd in almost every draft we have completely neglected our offense. The last offensive player the jets have drafted in the 1st round was mark sanchez and dustin keller. Its time to build that side of the ball up. We have no playmakers on offense. If we can get some talent on that side of the ball maybe one of the young qbs won't look like complete dog shit. Side rant: how come these defensive coaches come in here and draft only defensive players. If i was a defensive guru I would put all my resources into the offense. I'm confident in my coaching abilities and schemes on defense, so i can do more with less. If I can build an offense to be as strong as my defense then we are dangerous on both sides of the ball. |
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Post by mrcoops on Mar 28, 2017 5:51:12 GMT -5
There are only 2 defensive players I would draft at #6 as things stand...Myles Garrett (snowballs chance in hell he's there) and Jamal Adams (looking more and more unlikely he's there). Otherwise...it's all about Fournette/Howard. I think Lattimore is the best CB in the draft, but I'm not taking a guy with chronic hamstring issues that high in an absolutely stacked DB class. Would rather add an offensive playmaker at #6 and then you could still possibly grab a Fabian Moreau, Adoree Jackson or Chidobe Awuzie at #39. I feel exactly the same way. If not Garrett (almost zero chance) or Adams (maybe a 25% chance he is there) then Fournette and Howard look to be the best options at 6. My personal preference is Howard, who I believe can be special, but I could get on board with Fournette also given his pure talent. Get one of those four guys at six, or trade down. |
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Post by beerfish on Mar 28, 2017 10:24:19 GMT -5
My biggest hope scenario is traded down even right out of the 1st round and get another 1st next year. Failing that just another pick or so in the 2nd/3rd round range.
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Post by Sonny Werblin on Mar 28, 2017 16:21:01 GMT -5
There are only 2 defensive players I would draft at #6 as things stand...Myles Garrett (snowballs chance in hell he's there) and Jamal Adams (looking more and more unlikely he's there). Otherwise...it's all about Fournette/Howard. I think Lattimore is the best CB in the draft, but I'm not taking a guy with chronic hamstring issues that high in an absolutely stacked DB class. Would rather add an offensive playmaker at #6 and then you could still possibly grab a Fabian Moreau, Adoree Jackson or Chidobe Awuzie at #39. I feel exactly the same way. If not Garrett (almost zero chance) or Adams (maybe a 25% chance he is there) then Fournette and Howard look to be the best options at 6. My personal preference is Howard, who I believe can be special, but I could get on board with Fournette also given his pure talent. Get one of those four guys at six, or trade down. Howard would be a good choice at 6. TE's can have long careers. And with Hackenberg, the bigger the target the better. Jets could split Q and Decker wide, let ASJ be in the slot, and have Howard at TE. That would create a massive match-up problem for the D backs. |
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