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Post by Trades on Apr 6, 2017 8:35:07 GMT -5
As someone who is intimately aware of the "quality" of government workers, I am solidly against any solution that involves said workers, ESPECIALLY "managers". In the corporate world, its accepted that there is an 80-20 ratio of good to bad workers. Government reverses that, and its scary. But, as someone who has had to fight with a private insurance company who wanted to deny me benefits, I wish to god the ratio was 80-20. The situation of waiting for an asshole is a cubicle who seemed hell bent on seeing me die gives one a new perspective. Please don't make insurers out to be good guys. He was probably one of our fellow board members which would explain his desire. |
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Post by Ff2 on Apr 6, 2017 8:36:20 GMT -5
But, as someone who has had to fight with a private insurance company who wanted to deny me benefits, I wish to god the ratio was 80-20. The situation of waiting for an asshole is a cubicle who seemed hell bent on seeing me die gives one a new perspective. Please don't make insurers out to be good guys. He was probably one of our fellow board members which would explain his desire. No, he spoke coherently. |
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Post by Trades on Apr 6, 2017 8:37:21 GMT -5
Progress requires? What the hell does that mean? Progress toward what? Crippling debt, poor healthcare and socialism? You hate government but you want to hand them one of the most important choices in life. You are brain washed into thinking that government has better answers than you do. EVERYONE in America has access to healthcare. Adding the government will not make it more affordable. Having more choices, market controls, freedom to choose what you want to buy, etc will make it more affordable. Look into Medicare and Medicaid fraud and tell me that the government is going to lower costs. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS FREE. Someone has to pay for everything. All you are doing is changing WHO you pay. Do you want to pay 50% in income tax plus higher state and sales taxes? Who do you think will pay for this "Free" healthcare? You are paying one way or another. Why would you want to hand the money to the government and let them make your choices for you? Do you want to do the same with your food, housing, phone service, car, etc? I assume the answer is no so why would you want them making such an important choice as healthcare when you can see how it is not working around the world. perhaps the answer lies in reforming government -- not the tweaking kind of reforms people speak of normally -- but a real profound change. Frankly, I want revolutionary type changes. A balanced budget amendment, term limits, and outlawing government employee unions would be a good start. As to healthcare, so long as for profit insurance companies and providers are involved, costs will increase profoundly. They are pigs at the trough, much like our college education system. Thank you for making my point. College costs are so high for EXACTLY the same reason healthcare is. The government is totally entwined with both processes and they are skewing the market. Take the government out of the equation and let these indoctrination machines exist on their own. They can do it without tax money. |
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Post by Ff2 on Apr 6, 2017 8:37:25 GMT -5
Progress requires? What the hell does that mean? Progress toward what? Crippling debt, poor healthcare and socialism? You hate government but you want to hand them one of the most important choices in life. You are brain washed into thinking that government has better answers than you do. EVERYONE in America has access to healthcare. Adding the government will not make it more affordable. Having more choices, market controls, freedom to choose what you want to buy, etc will make it more affordable. Look into Medicare and Medicaid fraud and tell me that the government is going to lower costs. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS FREE. Someone has to pay for everything. All you are doing is changing WHO you pay. Do you want to pay 50% in income tax plus higher state and sales taxes? Who do you think will pay for this "Free" healthcare? You are paying one way or another. Why would you want to hand the money to the government and let them make your choices for you? Do you want to do the same with your food, housing, phone service, car, etc? I assume the answer is no so why would you want them making such an important choice as healthcare when you can see how it is not working around the world. This. We we ever added in a layer between us and doctors Ill never understand. |
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Post by quantum on Apr 6, 2017 8:41:04 GMT -5
As someone who is intimately aware of the "quality" of government workers, I am solidly against any solution that involves said workers, ESPECIALLY "managers". In the corporate world, its accepted that there is an 80-20 ratio of good to bad workers. Government reverses that, and its scary. But, as someone who has had to fight with a private insurance company who wanted to deny me benefits, I wish to god the ratio was 80-20. The situation of waiting for an asshole is a cubicle who seemed hell bent on seeing me die gives one a new perspective. Please don't make insurers out to be good guys. I'm not. If you could rub 2 brain cells together, you'd see my message is: as bad as you think it is, ITS 100X WORSE WITH THE GOVERNMENT! common. srsly |
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Post by Trades on Apr 6, 2017 8:41:32 GMT -5
As to healthcare, so long as for profit insurance companies and providers are involved, costs will increase profoundly. They are pigs at the trough, much like our college education system. This. We we ever added in a layer between us and doctors Ill never understand. The way I understand it, major use of health insurance as a prepay system was encouraged by FDR due to horrific tax policies that gave employers loopholes to avoid taxes for their employees. Tax rates were so high a raise wasn't very attractive but employer paid health insurance was a tax free perk that could be offered and the employer could write it off as a business expense too. More democratic social engineering at its finest. |
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Post by Ff2 on Apr 6, 2017 8:47:47 GMT -5
But, as someone who has had to fight with a private insurance company who wanted to deny me benefits, I wish to god the ratio was 80-20. The situation of waiting for an asshole is a cubicle who seemed hell bent on seeing me die gives one a new perspective. Please don't make insurers out to be good guys. I'm not. If you could rub 2 brain cells together, you'd see my message is: as bad as you think it is, ITS 100X WORSE WITH THE GOVERNMENT! common. srsly Well 80-2 versus 20-80 is NOT 100x worse. You are horrible at math! |
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Post by BEAC0NJET on Apr 6, 2017 9:22:07 GMT -5
This. We we ever added in a layer between us and doctors Ill never understand. The way I understand it, major use of health insurance as a prepay system was encouraged by FDR due to horrific tax policies that gave employers loopholes to avoid taxes for their employees. Tax rates were so high a raise wasn't very attractive but employer paid health insurance was a tax free perk that could be offered and the employer could write it off as a business expense too. More democratic social engineering at its finest. Thats always been my understanding as well, that employer provided health insurance became an attractive benefit back then to bring on employees, while writing off the cost. |
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Post by Jetworks on Apr 6, 2017 9:42:38 GMT -5
As to healthcare, so long as for profit insurance companies and providers are involved, costs will increase profoundly. They are pigs at the trough, much like our college education system. This. We we ever added in a layer between us and doctors Ill never understand. Kind of inaccurate. They are pigs, but the trough was set out for them by governmental regulations and requirements placed on healthcare providers. As usual, the key is tort reform and the tossing out of government "protections" which were placed with (mostly) well-meaning intentions. Like Sonny said, tear up the book and write a new one, because adding chapters is making for more confusion, and thereby, more opportunities for exploitation. |
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Post by Sonny Werblin on Apr 6, 2017 10:42:39 GMT -5
perhaps the answer lies in reforming government -- not the tweaking kind of reforms people speak of normally -- but a real profound change. Frankly, I want revolutionary type changes. A balanced budget amendment, term limits, and outlawing government employee unions would be a good start. As to healthcare, so long as for profit insurance companies and providers are involved, costs will increase profoundly. They are pigs at the trough, much like our college education system. Thank you for making my point. College costs are so high for EXACTLY the same reason healthcare is. The government is totally entwined with both processes and they are skewing the market. Take the government out of the equation and let these indoctrination machines exist on their own. They can do it without tax money. Obamacare, costs and insurance rates rose every year at an alarming rate. So, how did I make your point? So long as the providers know there is a bloated insurance company to pay the bill, costs of actual healthcare will rise. And because the insurance companies want to make a profit, insurance rates will rise. Removing the government does not fix this problem. And the education problem is all of the private banks that get into the student loan business because it is so damned prifitable. So long as the college knows you can borrow more, they will charge it. Mark Cuban has it right. There should be a cap on the amount a student can borrow in a year. Put the cap in and the costs will decrease because there will be no money to pay the bill. |
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Post by Trades on Apr 6, 2017 11:46:17 GMT -5
Thank you for making my point. College costs are so high for EXACTLY the same reason healthcare is. The government is totally entwined with both processes and they are skewing the market. Take the government out of the equation and let these indoctrination machines exist on their own. They can do it without tax money. Obamacare, costs and insurance rates rose every year at an alarming rate. So, how did I make your point? So long as the providers know there is a bloated insurance company to pay the bill, costs of actual healthcare will rise. And because the insurance companies want to make a profit, insurance rates will rise. Removing the government does not fix this problem. And the education problem is all of the private banks that get into the student loan business because it is so damned prifitable. So long as the college knows you can borrow more, they will charge it. Mark Cuban has it right. There should be a cap on the amount a student can borrow in a year. Put the cap in and the costs will decrease because there will be no money to pay the bill. Even before Obamacare government Medicare and Medicaid skewed pricing. As for college how about the government doesn't guarantee the loan and loans are based on qualifications and ability to pay. That is what makes it profitable. The loans are guaranteed with tax payer money. |
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Post by Sonny Werblin on Apr 6, 2017 12:41:06 GMT -5
This. We we ever added in a layer between us and doctors Ill never understand. Kind of inaccurate. They are pigs, but the trough was set out for them by governmental regulations and requirements placed on healthcare providers. As usual, the key is tort reform and the tossing out of government "protections" which were placed with (mostly) well-meaning intentions. Like Sonny said, tear up the book and write a new one, because adding chapters is making for more confusion, and thereby, more opportunities for exploitation. Tort reform is the biggest boondoggle since the coming fluorocarbon created ice age. |
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Post by Sonny Werblin on Apr 6, 2017 12:43:13 GMT -5
Bottom line: Everyone here has better ideas then the idiots running things. Corporate interests control the pols, and the status quo is making them all fatter and richer by the day on our wasted tax dollars.
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Post by Trades on Apr 6, 2017 12:46:09 GMT -5
Bottom line: Everyone here has better ideas then the idiots running things. Corporate interests control the pols, and the status quo is making them all fatter and richer by the day on our wasted tax dollars. How does this align with you thinking a single payer government system is the answer? |
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Post by Sonny Werblin on Apr 6, 2017 18:44:57 GMT -5
Bottom line: Everyone here has better ideas then the idiots running things. Corporate interests control the pols, and the status quo is making them all fatter and richer by the day on our wasted tax dollars. How does this align with you thinking a single payer government system is the answer? The Australian system is not a single payer system. And there is no perfect answer here. There never will be. But, really, do you see a system 50 years from now with private insurance companies turning a tidy profit between you and your healthcare provider? |
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