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Post by Jetworks on Jan 9, 2015 17:18:13 GMT -5
Saw today that the POTUS wants to afford a free, two year, community college education to anyone willing to "work hard" for it. Apparently, this would entail a student attending at least part-time and holding a 2.5 GPA, not exactly the definition of a hard-working student. As someone finishing up their AAS at a community school I would've welcomed this, but the standard needs to be higher. www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2015/01/08/obama-free-community-college/21466969/
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Post by DDNYjets on Jan 9, 2015 17:28:24 GMT -5
Make it 3.5 while majoring in some sort of science or technology and I might entertain it. And if this is for "workers" then it should be made into a tax credit or rebate. Get people on the books paying paying into the system and broadening the base.
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Post by Jetworks on Jan 9, 2015 17:59:31 GMT -5
Make it 3.5 while majoring in some sort of science or technology and I might entertain it. And if this is for "workers" then it should be made into a tax credit or rebate. Get people on the books paying paying into the system and broadening the base. Agree on that part, but the 3.5 would be tough to maintain. I'm going into my final semester for my RN/AAS and I'm barely holding on to my 3.6, and I am a nerd who busts his ass. The prerequisite stuff is easy enough to hold that level, but once you start hitting major courses, it's hard.
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Post by DDNYjets on Jan 9, 2015 18:49:13 GMT -5
Make it 3.5 while majoring in some sort of science or technology and I might entertain it. And if this is for "workers" then it should be made into a tax credit or rebate. Get people on the books paying paying into the system and broadening the base. Agree on that part, but the 3.5 would be tough to maintain. I'm going into my final semester for my RN/AAS and I'm barely holding on to my 3.6, and I am a nerd who busts his ass. The prerequisite stuff is easy enough to hold that level, but once you start hitting major courses, it's hard. You also have two children that require great assistance not to mention your cyber children that need constant moderation . If you can maintain a 3.6 what is everyone else's excuse? It is the people like you that should be rewarded.
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Post by rexneffect on Jan 9, 2015 19:02:49 GMT -5
A person with a 2.5 can be reasonably expected to transfer into a four year program or find a job that would accept a two year program. Setting the bar at 3.5 is a nice idea but more likely to deter people from accessing the program and in turn would not have the effect of encouraging people to obtain further education who otherwise would not.
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Post by Jetworks on Jan 9, 2015 19:03:23 GMT -5
Agree on that part, but the 3.5 would be tough to maintain. I'm going into my final semester for my RN/AAS and I'm barely holding on to my 3.6, and I am a nerd who busts his ass. The prerequisite stuff is easy enough to hold that level, but once you start hitting major courses, it's hard. You also have two children that require great assistance not to mention your cyber children that need constant moderation . If you can maintain a 3.6 what is everyone else's excuse? It is the people like you that should be rewarded. Well, it's impossible for me to be humble and agree with that point, so thanks. Honestly, I can't see how this will work. They've already said the Feds will only support 75% (no small amount), so it already has warts. Hell, I can't even get my current school to fix my registration dates and I had to beg them to hold off dropping me from any courses until my grant money kicked in. Otherwise, they carry it over to your next semester AFTER you lay out all the money. Shitshow.
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Post by Jetworks on Jan 9, 2015 19:10:51 GMT -5
A person with a 2.5 can be reasonably expected to transfer into a four year program or find a job that would accept a two year program. Setting the bar at 3.5 is a nice idea but more likely to deter people from accessing the program and in turn would not have the effect of encouraging people to obtain further education who otherwise would not. Ummm, that's kind of the point. If you are getting something handed to you, you should at least be willing to be held to a high standard. If not, how can you justify being given something in the first place if you aren't worthy? By setting the standard so low, the only thing you are ensuring is that plenty of people will be able to get degrees in areas that aren't going to necessarily achieve the grand vision of making America a force in academia and the workplace, which is supposed to be the whole point of this program. To get into my nursing program you needed at least a 3.5 plus a high score on the NLN to be considered. There are many, myself included, that exceeded that threshold and thereby ensured a quality pool of candidates that would eventually enter the healthcare arena. Those that didn't cut it could try again or pursue something else. Shouldn't the same be true of students getting free educations intended to eventually better our country through their entrance into the workforce? Granted, I agree with you that 3.5 is unrealistic, but 2.5 is not the answer either.
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Post by Big L on Jan 9, 2015 20:05:57 GMT -5
How 'bout 3.0, then?
seems rather obvious.....
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Post by wesleymctoon on Jan 10, 2015 8:49:05 GMT -5
$70 billion, huh? Should be easy to find.
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Post by sec.101row23 on Jan 10, 2015 10:22:54 GMT -5
All you have to do is show up to class to get a 2.5 GPA in Community College. When I was in college anyone who had a merit based scholarship or grant had to maintain a minimum of a 3.0, some instances it was higher. I guess eventually community college will just become 13th and 14th grade.
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Post by Lithfan on Jan 10, 2015 11:11:09 GMT -5
We had a program at a local community college a few years ago that was similar. The college received a sizable grant that provided free tuition for any student who met an annual community service requirement. The service hours required for entry to the program was ridiculously low and there were no minimum GPA standards. The program was a disaster. Kids who had no interest in college, but could not find jobs took advantage of the program and dropped out of school once they found jobs -- or they flunked out.
The program ran out of money, thankfully, the year before my daughter graduated high school. She now is in that college and doing great. I am not sure what her experience would have been like had that program still been around.
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Post by Trades on Jan 10, 2015 12:23:12 GMT -5
All you have to do is show up to class to get a 2.5 GPA in Community College. When I was in college anyone who had a merit based scholarship or grant had to maintain a minimum of a 3.0, some instances it was higher. I guess eventually community college will just become 13th and 14th grade. If only. My stepmom's nephew just "finished" his first semester in community college. Last I heard he failed 4 of his 5 classes and hadn't gotten a grade yet in the 5th. The parents are delusional liberal morons, mom teaches English as a 2nd language at that community college and the father is a murse (not that there is anything wrong with that and that is not whey I call them morons). I call them morons because of their choices and life and the father's belief that the son should have gone to MIT! MIT!!!!! He did horrible in high school and is failing community college. The only thing he is good at so far is working at McDonalds. Now the kid isn't stupid but I think that school is not for him. He is the perfect example of someone that should be in trade school, have an apprenticeship or just keep working his way up in McDonalds. I think many people aren't cut out for college or the jobs that they supposedly prepare you for. The kid also doesn't have the personality or temperament for the military or I would have included that in my recommendations because the best thing for this kid is to get out of his parents house and grow up a bit. <rant>I think giving free college to everyone is a major mistake. If you have no stake in the game then there are few that will prosper. The best thing for this country would be to dry up some of the ridiculous college loan programs that are putting kids $200k in the hole before they get out with a useless degree. Loan/give money to smart kids with aptitude, a history of achievement and that are in a program that can see a return on the investment. Let the losers that have skated through life, haven't worked hard at their past 12 free years of studies or want to get a useless degree get the money from somewhere else. There is no reason we should be paying or subsidizing loans for these people. All that being said there are a lot of other places our government is totally pissing our money away for no gain so at the very least this program would directly help people. However we should be looking at spending less money rather than looking for more ways to spend.</rant>
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Post by Touchable on Jan 10, 2015 12:33:06 GMT -5
All you have to do is show up to class to get a 2.5 GPA in Community College. When I was in college anyone who had a merit based scholarship or grant had to maintain a minimum of a 3.0, some instances it was higher. I guess eventually community college will just become 13th and 14th grade. If only. My stepmom's nephew just "finished" his first semester in community college. Last I heard he failed 4 of his 5 classes and hadn't gotten a grade yet in the 5th. The parents are delusional liberal morons, mom teaches English as a 2nd language at that community college and the father is a murse (not that there is anything wrong with that and that is not whey I call them morons). I call them morons because of their choices and life and the father's belief that the son should have gone to MIT! MIT!!!!! He did horrible in high school and is failing community college. The only thing he is good at so far is working at McDonalds. Now the kid isn't stupid but I think that school is not for him. He is the perfect example of someone that should be in trade school, have an apprenticeship or just keep working his way up in McDonalds. I think many people aren't cut out for college or the jobs that they supposedly prepare you for. The kid also doesn't have the personality or temperament for the military or I would have included that in my recommendations because the best thing for this kid is to get out of his parents house and grow up a bit. <rant>I think giving free college to everyone is a major mistake. If you have no stake in the game then there are few that will prosper. The best thing for this country would be to dry up some of the ridiculous college loan programs that are putting kids $200k in the hole before they get out with a useless degree. Loan/give money to smart kids with aptitude, a history of achievement and that are in a program that can see a return on the investment. Let the losers that have skated through life, haven't worked hard at their past 12 free years of studies or want to get a useless degree get the money from somewhere else. There is no reason we should be paying or subsidizing loans for these people. All that being said there are a lot of other places our government is totally pissing our money away for no gain so at the very least this program would directly help people. However we should be looking at spending less money rather than looking for more ways to spend.</rant> There are many who would argue that getting into a trade and going through a 4-5 year apprenticeship is better than most 4 year degrees these days. It's what I did back in the mid-late 80's after I dropped out of college and I never regretted it. Personally, I just always hated school outside of the social aspect of it and could never picture myself sitting behind a computer in a little office cubicle for 8+ hours a day for the rest of my life. Some people simply prefer physical labor, being outside and working with their hands. Getting into a plumbing, pipefitting, carpentry, or electrician apprenticeship is extremely affordable when stacked next to a 4 year degree and you're basically guaranteed to always have a well paying job as long as your halfway competent at what you do.
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Post by Trades on Jan 10, 2015 12:37:06 GMT -5
If only. My stepmom's nephew just "finished" his first semester in community college. Last I heard he failed 4 of his 5 classes and hadn't gotten a grade yet in the 5th. The parents are delusional liberal morons, mom teaches English as a 2nd language at that community college and the father is a murse (not that there is anything wrong with that and that is not whey I call them morons). I call them morons because of their choices and life and the father's belief that the son should have gone to MIT! MIT!!!!! He did horrible in high school and is failing community college. The only thing he is good at so far is working at McDonalds. Now the kid isn't stupid but I think that school is not for him. He is the perfect example of someone that should be in trade school, have an apprenticeship or just keep working his way up in McDonalds. I think many people aren't cut out for college or the jobs that they supposedly prepare you for. The kid also doesn't have the personality or temperament for the military or I would have included that in my recommendations because the best thing for this kid is to get out of his parents house and grow up a bit. <rant>I think giving free college to everyone is a major mistake. If you have no stake in the game then there are few that will prosper. The best thing for this country would be to dry up some of the ridiculous college loan programs that are putting kids $200k in the hole before they get out with a useless degree. Loan/give money to smart kids with aptitude, a history of achievement and that are in a program that can see a return on the investment. Let the losers that have skated through life, haven't worked hard at their past 12 free years of studies or want to get a useless degree get the money from somewhere else. There is no reason we should be paying or subsidizing loans for these people. All that being said there are a lot of other places our government is totally pissing our money away for no gain so at the very least this program would directly help people. However we should be looking at spending less money rather than looking for more ways to spend.</rant> There are many who would argue that getting into a trade and going through a 4-5 year apprenticeship is better than most 4 year degrees these days. It's what I did back in the mid-late 80's after I dropped out of college and I never regretted it. Personally, I just always hated school outside of the social aspect of it and could never picture myself sitting behind a computer in a little office cubicle for 8+ hours a day for the rest of my life. Some people simply prefer physical labor, being outside and working with their hands. Getting into a plumbing, pipefitting, carpentry, or electrician apprenticeship is extremely affordable when stacked next to a 4 year degree and you're basically guaranteed to always have a well paying job as long as your halfway competent at what you do. and if you aren't competent you can just join a union.
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Post by Touchable on Jan 10, 2015 12:37:46 GMT -5
There are many who would argue that getting into a trade and going through a 4-5 year apprenticeship is better than most 4 year degrees these days. It's what I did back in the mid-late 80's after I dropped out of college and I never regretted it. Personally, I just always hated school outside of the social aspect of it and could never picture myself sitting behind a computer in a little office cubicle for 8+ hours a day for the rest of my life. Some people simply prefer physical labor, being outside and working with their hands. Getting into a plumbing, pipefitting, carpentry, or electrician apprenticeship is extremely affordable when stacked next to a 4 year degree and you're basically guaranteed to always have a well paying job as long as your halfway competent at what you do. and if you aren't competent you can just join a union. LOL Pretty much
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