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Post by BEAC0NJET on Feb 16, 2018 10:18:44 GMT -5
Yet the President, House and Senate pretty quietly approved and signed off on H.J. Res 40 w/in the last year which rolls back an Obama-era regulation that made it harder for people with mental illnesses to purchase a gun. The original rule added people receiving Social Security checks for mental illnesses and people deemed unfit to handle their own financial affairs to the national background check database. Nice and simple, straight-forward - it required the Social Security Administration to send records of beneficiaries with severe mental disabilities to the FBI’s National Instant Criminal Background Check System. The measure would have affected about 75,000 people found mentally incapable of managing their financial affairs, with the assumption that those might be high risk individuals for going off the deep end and being violent. Seems pretty reasonable. The problem is, the NRA, Disabilities Rights Groups AND the ACLU all were against the original legislation. That's a lot of big money at play on both sides of the aisle. www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/trump-signs-bill-revoking-obama-era-gun-checks-people-mental-n727221To me, thats moving in the wrong direction. This regulation, that he put in December, 2016 on his way out the door would have probably been challenged in court and lost, like many things he did with his pen and phone. This regulation targeted people who basically couldnt manage their own finances for themselves. What are the odds of these people buying a gun if they dont even have control of their own money? If anything is to be passed, it needs to be real. People with violent criminal records. We all know what the "scary" nutjobs look like and what they say. We need something that deals with them. Not the kids with Downs syndrome spitting up their oatmeal. Aren't we already supposedly checking against violent criminal records? That should be a no-brainer for not selling guns. The problem lately with many of these mass shooters is that they are likely on the spectrum with emotional and mental issues, but no criminal records. They don't look like the textbook scary nutjobs. Someone mentioned this latest one, the guy may have had some level of autism. The issue with that is that you're going to have to offend some folks and not be PC in order to ban/block/get them on the list for not selling to.
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Post by BEAC0NJET on Feb 16, 2018 10:27:16 GMT -5
I don't think there is an easy answer and sadly with the politicization of the IRS and FBI is anyone confident that a "people with mental health issues" provision wouldn't be turned as a political weapon by either party? I'm not. I think the article about people getting involved with their communities is spot on. I also think that if the current laws were enforced it would be a big help. There is no way that this kid or the one that shot up the school should have been able to pass a background check. The problem is there are too many holes in the system. As one article said, all of the existing and proposed rules, laws and changes wouldn't have stopped any of these shootings. They are just feel good laws to say we "did something". Agreed. There's too many special interests as well on either side involved worried about infringing on peoples rights. It sounds corny but the whole "see something say something" rings true. And sadly, if you limit magazine size, or ban AR-15s, this same profile of mass shooter is going to get a bunch of semi-automatic handguns with the highest capacity he can find, and still try to shoot up soft targets. He may not kill 17 people, but he may get 5, 6, 10, and its still a tragedy. Dude killed 13 people at Ft Hood with a semi-auto FN Five-Seven handgun.
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Post by Jetworks on Feb 16, 2018 10:45:43 GMT -5
Guns, race, ideology; all easy, stationary goalposts to take a whack at by the outraged masses. The moving target no one seems to be talking about is prescription medications. It's a significant, common theme, so you have to wonder why it isn't emphasized more. Well, I don't, but the general public has to begin to, because it's a root cause.
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Post by DDNYjets on Feb 16, 2018 10:53:17 GMT -5
Guns, race, ideology; all easy, stationary goalposts to take a whack at by the outraged masses. The moving target no one seems to be talking about is prescription medications. It's a significant, common theme, so you have to wonder why it isn't emphasized more. Well, I don't, but the general public has to begin to, because it's a root cause. Follow the money. Just like the NRA.
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Post by 2foolish on Feb 16, 2018 11:00:02 GMT -5
the 2nd amend.doesn't say we have the right to bear arms against the millitia...its two separate statements... A well regulated militia has the right to bear arms. The well regulated milita is supposed to be The People. A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed....people forget the commas in the amendment...meaning to separate items on a list...meaning these are two separate statements of rights that are being protected by the same clause...
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Post by tkasper01 on Feb 16, 2018 11:08:27 GMT -5
A well regulated militia has the right to bear arms. The well regulated milita is supposed to be The People. A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed....people forget the commas in the amendment...meaning to separate items on a list...meaning these are two separate statements of rights that are being protected by the same clause... Ok. Tomato tomoto. No where does it say you have the right to own a weapon that has no real functional use other then killing large parts of society quickly and effectively. These weapons need to be restricted/banned.
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Post by Trades on Feb 16, 2018 11:13:02 GMT -5
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed....people forget the commas in the amendment...meaning to separate items on a list...meaning these are two separate statements of rights that are being protected by the same clause... Ok. Tomato tomoto. No where does it say you have the right to own a weapon that has no real functional use other then killing large parts of society quickly and effectively. These weapons need to be restricted/banned. Where is that line? Single shot? Flint lock? How scary the gun looks? At close range you could do just as much damage with 4 pistols with 12 shot mags as an AR. Not saying you are wrong but which are "those weapons"?
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Post by DDNYjets on Feb 16, 2018 11:14:48 GMT -5
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed....people forget the commas in the amendment...meaning to separate items on a list...meaning these are two separate statements of rights that are being protected by the same clause... Ok. Tomato tomoto. No where does it say you have the right to own a weapon that has no real functional use other then killing large parts of society quickly and effectively. These weapons need to be restricted/banned. And nowhere does it say we can rip babies out of their mother's wombs with tongs but somehow we think that has something to do with 9th Amednment and privacy.
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Post by tkasper01 on Feb 16, 2018 11:33:08 GMT -5
Ok. Tomato tomoto. No where does it say you have the right to own a weapon that has no real functional use other then killing large parts of society quickly and effectively. These weapons need to be restricted/banned. Where is that line? Single shot? Flint lock? How scary the gun looks? At close range you could do just as much damage with 4 pistols with 12 shot mags as an AR. Not saying you are wrong but which are "those weapons"? I am not smart enough to answer nor do I really know enough. I just see this type of weapon as the default go to for these fucking nut jobs. I think we can craft restrictions that makes it more difficult to obtain or banned outright is all.
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Post by DDNYjets on Feb 16, 2018 11:36:04 GMT -5
Now we're getting to the crux.
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Post by 2foolish on Feb 16, 2018 11:55:57 GMT -5
Where is that line? Single shot? Flint lock? How scary the gun looks? At close range you could do just as much damage with 4 pistols with 12 shot mags as an AR. Not saying you are wrong but which are "those weapons"? I am not smart enough to answer nor do I really know enough. I just see this type of weapon as the default go to for these fucking nut jobs. I think we can craft restrictions that makes it more difficult to obtain or banned outright is all. finally...something we can all agree on...lol...
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Post by 2foolish on Feb 16, 2018 12:04:34 GMT -5
Ok. Tomato tomoto. No where does it say you have the right to own a weapon that has no real functional use other then killing large parts of society quickly and effectively. These weapons need to be restricted/banned. Where is that line? Single shot? Flint lock? How scary the gun looks? At close range you could do just as much damage with 4 pistols with 12 shot mags as an AR. Not saying you are wrong but which are "those weapons"? yes but i have to say that i don't know of any other use for the AR-15 than to kill a bunch of people really fast...i think they should be regulated the same way hand guns are...
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Post by Hotman on Feb 16, 2018 12:20:37 GMT -5
How long til they try to hide all these first hand accounts?
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Post by DDNYjets on Feb 16, 2018 12:52:36 GMT -5
Im not suprised. Clean house. www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/fbi-statement-on-the-shooting-in-parkland-floridaOn January 5, 2018, a person close to Nikolas Cruz contacted the FBI’s Public Access Line (PAL) tipline to report concerns about him. The caller provided information about Cruz’s gun ownership, desire to kill people, erratic behavior, and disturbing social media posts, as well as the potential of him conducting a school shooting. Under established protocols, the information provided by the caller should have been assessed as a potential threat to life. The information then should have been forwarded to the FBI Miami Field Office, where appropriate investigative steps would have been taken. We have determined that these protocols were not followed for the information received by the PAL on January 5. The information was not provided to the Miami Field Office, and no further investigation was conducted at that time. FBI Director Christopher Wray said: “We are still investigating the facts. I am committed to getting to the bottom of what happened in this particular matter, as well as reviewing our processes for responding to information that we receive from the public. It’s up to all Americans to be vigilant, and when members of the public contact us with concerns, we must act properly and quickly. “We have spoken with victims and families, and deeply regret the additional pain this causes all those affected by this horrific tragedy. All of the men and women of the FBI are dedicated to keeping the American people safe, and are relentlessly committed to improving all that we do and how we do it.”
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Post by 32Green on Feb 16, 2018 13:41:55 GMT -5
All of the men and women of the FBI are dedicated to keeping the American people safe, and are relentlessly committed to improving all that we do and how we do it.” No they certainly are not. And if this is the Directors true beliefs, he needs to hit the bricks pronto. It is this blind ignorance of the institutionalized politicization and incompetence that has caused the FBI to fumble scores of investigations going back to 9/11 when they knew who the hi-jackers were as soon as the attack happened... How do you read this as a parent of a child killed there? How do you not make it your lifes mission to now ensure the FBI is flushed of its lethargy and bureaucracy? The FBI fucking killed these kids as sure as if they were in the classrooms. My only thought is to get a former NYPD guy in there that was around when Guiliani turned the NYPD upside down. He needs to go in there with a machete and chop out the weeds. Dudes should fear for their jobs, go to jail if necessary. The media will try to bury this because it makes Trump look right...again.... the parents have the platform to make sure that doesnt happen.
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