|
Post by Touchable on Jan 7, 2015 9:29:07 GMT -5
@profootballtalk 1m1 minute ago PFT confirms FOX report Mike Tannenbaum is heading to Dolphins. He'll be the executive V.P. of football operations, starting Feb. 1. An accountant/agent as VP of Football Operations Lolz Super Lolz Lolzapalooza Not sure what is so funny? Like him or not, Tanny had success as GM of the NYJ. He gave me two of the best seasons in my lifetime as a Jets fan. I would not trade 09 and 10 except for a SB which we just fell short. Funny how so many, including me, shit on Izdick (rightly so) but still crap on Tanny's approach. Talk about a contradiction. You can't have it both ways. Yes, Tanny rolled the dice and fell just short. At least he had the balls to go for it! Not many teams can say that or claim to have the success the Jets enjoyed under his tenure. If this is true, we should worry as the Lolphins just became better. The hell do you mean, "why is it funny"? The Dolphins were talking about hiring a "football czar" and it turns out to be Mike fucking Tannenbaum. At least the Bills were trying to bring back a guy like Polian to oversee the team. Since when the hell does it take some kind of genius to throw big money at proven, pro-bowl players like Faneca, Jenkins, Woody, etc?
|
|
|
Post by carlito1171 on Jan 7, 2015 9:54:42 GMT -5
Some of you guys need to get over 09-10. Tanny did nothing ground breaking while he was here. Any GM could overpay players and trade half their draft to get certain players. He had no contingency plan when the bills came due in 2011 and he drove us into the ground....let him do the same to the Fish!
|
|
|
Post by jetstream23 on Jan 7, 2015 10:40:18 GMT -5
Kept Vlad Duccasse Simply because he was a high draft pick. Let Matt Slauson go and he eventually became a pro bowl caliber player in Chicago.
|
|
|
Post by sadface on Jan 7, 2015 10:53:37 GMT -5
Kept Vlad Duccasse Simply because he was a high draft pick. Let Matt Slauson go and he eventually became a pro bowl caliber player in Chicago. didnt Idzik let Slauson go?
|
|
|
Post by rexneffect on Jan 7, 2015 11:05:33 GMT -5
Not sure what is so funny? Like him or not, Tanny had success as GM of the NYJ. He gave me two of the best seasons in my lifetime as a Jets fan. I would not trade 09 and 10 except for a SB which we just fell short. Funny how so many, including me, shit on Izdick (rightly so) but still crap on Tanny's approach. Talk about a contradiction. You can't have it both ways. Yes, Tanny rolled the dice and fell just short. At least he had the balls to go for it! Not many teams can say that or claim to have the success the Jets enjoyed under his tenure. If this is true, we should worry as the Lolphins just became better. This is the absolute Madden approach to managing a team. When you can treat a team's money as though it's not your money and there is no consequence for spending away the next few years then it's very easy to "roll[ ] the dice" and "ha[ve] the balls to go for it". They could have brought in almost anybody with a little pro team management experience to overpay on contracts and trade away draft picks in favor of burning the cap on free agency. Although there were a lot of good draft picks during his tenure there were also a slew of terrible picks. His best draft was his first in 2006 and it was largely downhill from there, which strongly suggests that he was more coasting through that 2006 draft on the work of the management before him and relying on Bradway's advice more than he did in the future. There's certainly a strategy to try to push to go over the top to get back to the big game. It works as long as you have a guy who can make the full push and you are willing to live with the consequences. The problem here is that Tanny's contract problems and uneven drafting left us short and would always leave us short. He was also a guy who had the plan to make the big push and then had no plan for how to deal with the consequences of mortgaging the future after 2010. Look at the roster, the performance and the team culture left after 2010. In two years we went from having a stacked roster performing at a high level to a roster drained of most of its core talent and a broken team. Had he stayed the GM it's likely we would have been a 4-12 team this year but with fewer draft picks and less cap space. You'll always suffer in the future when you mortgage your future to buy a good team in the present. Some people are ok with that approach, particularly if it pays off, but it's certainly not a way to build a team with long term success. Idzik was like the anti-Tannenbaum but that doesn't mean he was any better. There is a lot of room for smart management between the two of them.
|
|
|
Post by jetstream23 on Jan 7, 2015 11:17:52 GMT -5
Kept Vlad Duccasse Simply because he was a high draft pick. Let Matt Slauson go and he eventually became a pro bowl caliber player in Chicago. didnt Idzik let Slauson go? I thought it was Tanny. I could be wrong.
|
|
|
Post by carlito1171 on Jan 7, 2015 11:27:06 GMT -5
Kept Vlad Duccasse Simply because he was a high draft pick. Let Matt Slauson go and he eventually became a pro bowl caliber player in Chicago. didnt Idzik let Slauson go? Nope it was Tanny.
|
|
|
Post by bxjetfan on Jan 7, 2015 11:34:21 GMT -5
LOL at all the Idzik ball washers taking a shit on Mike T. The guy put the most successful Jets team together since the SB and people still can't give the guy credit. Yeah, he made mistakes, all GMs do.
|
|
|
Post by Touchable on Jan 7, 2015 11:44:06 GMT -5
LOL at all the Idzik ball washers taking a shit on Mike T. The guy put the most successful Jets team together since the SB and people still can't give the guy credit. Yeah, he made mistakes, all GMs do. He mortgaged our future for a two year window. It doesn't take some kind of brilliant football mind to do that shit. You also don't have to be some kind of "football czar" to throw big money deals at veteran, established pro-bowlers like Alan Faneca, Damien Woody, or Kris Jenkins. Not to mention that the guys track record after we fired Mangini was absolute dogshit. Letting go of Cotchery in favor of Plaxico Burress/Derrick Mason? Giving Sanchez a big extension after a season in which he turned the ball over a league high 28 times? Paying Santonio Holmes over $10 million a year? Trading a 4th round pick for Tebow and bringing the circus to town when your trusted head of scouting was banging the table for Russell Wilson? The guy was a fucking mo-mo and I wish Miami all the worst.
|
|
|
Post by carlito1171 on Jan 7, 2015 12:17:57 GMT -5
LOL at all the Idzik ball washers taking a shit on Mike T. The guy put the most successful Jets team together since the SB and people still can't give the guy credit. Yeah, he made mistakes, all GMs do. Why is this always 1 vs other with you guys? I'm happy both of them are gone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tanny was 10x better GM then Idzik but that isn't saying much....
|
|
|
Post by vicmill on Jan 7, 2015 13:10:54 GMT -5
Not sure what is so funny? Like him or not, Tanny had success as GM of the NYJ. He gave me two of the best seasons in my lifetime as a Jets fan. I would not trade 09 and 10 except for a SB which we just fell short. Funny how so many, including me, shit on Izdick (rightly so) but still crap on Tanny's approach. Talk about a contradiction. You can't have it both ways. Yes, Tanny rolled the dice and fell just short. At least he had the balls to go for it! Not many teams can say that or claim to have the success the Jets enjoyed under his tenure. If this is true, we should worry as the Lolphins just became better. This is the absolute Madden approach to managing a team. When you can treat a team's money as though it's not your money and there is no consequence for spending away the next few years then it's very easy to "roll[ ] the dice" and "ha[ve] the balls to go for it". They could have brought in almost anybody with a little pro team management experience to overpay on contracts and trade away draft picks in favor of burning the cap on free agency. Although there were a lot of good draft picks during his tenure there were also a slew of terrible picks. His best draft was his first in 2006 and it was largely downhill from there, which strongly suggests that he was more coasting through that 2006 draft on the work of the management before him and relying on Bradway's advice more than he did in the future. There's certainly a strategy to try to push to go over the top to get back to the big game. It works as long as you have a guy who can make the full push and you are willing to live with the consequences. The problem here is that Tanny's contract problems and uneven drafting left us short and would always leave us short. He was also a guy who had the plan to make the big push and then had no plan for how to deal with the consequences of mortgaging the future after 2010. Look at the roster, the performance and the team culture left after 2010. In two years we went from having a stacked roster performing at a high level to a roster drained of most of its core talent and a broken team. Had he stayed the GM it's likely we would have been a 4-12 team this year but with fewer draft picks and less cap space. You'll always suffer in the future when you mortgage your future to buy a good team in the present. Some people are ok with that approach, particularly if it pays off, but it's certainly not a way to build a team with long term success. Idzik was like the anti-Tannenbaum but that doesn't mean he was any better. There is a lot of room for smart management between the two of them. Perfectly said!!! The thing that keeps the playing field fair in football is that the bill always comes due. Every dollar you pay out comes off the salary cap in one year or another. I used to laugh when everyone said that Tannenbaum was a salary cap guru. All he did was borrow from the future to pay for the present. A salary cap guru is really just a football guy who can assign the right value to players and not overpay. Every guy Tannenbaum signed came here for one reason and one reason only - he paid them more than anyone else. To name a few, Faneca got huge money to come here but was past his prime. He was decent but didn't provide the value his salary warranted. Jenkins was still in his prime and was great, but he was an injury waiting to happen. He paid big bucks for him, but it would have been a bargain had he stayed healthy. Problem was he was never going to stay healthy and the reason his price tag wasn't even higher than it was is because of the injury risk. Tannebaum again was willing to pay him more than anyone else and assume that injury risk, which came to pass (think Amare Stoudemire like) There is one way to at least partially hedge that bet though. If you manage to draft well in the middle or late rounds you can supplement your high priced players with a core of cheap players that contibute and offsets the big dollar free agents. Only problem was, Tannebaum gave away most of his middle and late round picks. I though Idzik was a breath of fresh air when he came. His strategy was to spend conservatively and acquire and retain draft picks. Its really the only way, I believe, to have sustainable excellence (see Pats, New England and Steelers, Pittsburgh). He just couldn't execute on it because he made lousy draft picks, under-valued some free agents and was probably overmatched by smart, experienced agents in the Board Room, who called his bluff and just went elsewhere for their money. My guess is that if Idzik gets another chance someday, he will have learned from his mistakes, hire a great personnel guy as a #2 to draft and place a realistic value on free agents and better execute on his strategy.
|
|
|
Post by jetstream23 on Jan 7, 2015 13:23:30 GMT -5
LOL at all the Idzik ball washers taking a shit on Mike T. The guy put the most successful Jets team together since the SB and people still can't give the guy credit. Yeah, he made mistakes, all GMs do. He mortgaged our future for a two year window. It doesn't take some kind of brilliant football mind to do that shit. You also don't have to be some kind of "football czar" to throw big money deals at veteran, established pro-bowlers like Alan Faneca, Damien Woody, or Kris Jenkins. Not to mention that the guys track record after we fired Mangini was absolute dogshit. Letting go of Cotchery in favor of Plaxico Burress/Derrick Mason? Giving Sanchez a big extension after a season in which he turned the ball over a league high 28 times? Paying Santonio Holmes over $10 million a year? Trading a 4th round pick for Tebow and bringing the circus to town when your trusted head of scouting was banging the table for Russell Wilson? The guy was a fucking mo-mo and I wish Miami all the worst. I partially agree. I do not think it's necessarily a bad idea to go "all in" periodically when you think you have a team on the cusp of a SB. The Jets were clearly in striking distance around 2010. After two AFCCGs there was a thought that the Jets were just a player or two away and the organization made a decision to swing for the fences, whether there was a fastball coming or not. Again, I don't wholeheartedly disagree with that approach. However, the thing I disagree with is that Jets were still a relatively young team with a young 1st round QB, a stud defender in Revis who was in his prime, etc. so I think the idea that the window was going to close quickly wasn't right. It's not like the 2010 Jets were this current year's Broncos, trying to get one last run out of Peyton Manning and pushing all their chips to the center of the table. That's where I disagree with the approach. Regardless of how it turned out with Sanchez, Revis' contract demands, etc. there was the semblance of a core with the Jets and it was not the right time to go "all in." Teams like the Broncos and possibly the Patriots see a window closing in the next couple years with their QBs so I think their approach may be different. Tannenbaum gambled and lost....he should have been trying to hit singles and doubles, not a homerun with that team by mortgaging the future.
|
|
|
Post by greenwave on Jan 7, 2015 13:40:59 GMT -5
LOL at all the Idzik ball washers taking a shit on Mike T. The guy put the most successful Jets team together since the SB and people still can't give the guy credit. Yeah, he made mistakes, all GMs do. Why is this always 1 vs other with you guys? I'm happy both of them are gone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Tanny was 10x better GM then Idzik but that isn't saying much.... Exactly. They both sucked. I'd prefer Tanny over Idzik, but in the way that I'd prefer malaria over tuberculosis.
|
|
|
Post by joepnyj1 on Jan 7, 2015 14:32:24 GMT -5
LOL at all the Idzik ball washers taking a shit on Mike T. The guy put the most successful Jets team together since the SB and people still can't give the guy credit. Yeah, he made mistakes, all GMs do. He mortgaged our future for a two year window. It doesn't take some kind of brilliant football mind to do that shit. You also don't have to be some kind of "football czar" to throw big money deals at veteran, established pro-bowlers like Alan Faneca, Damien Woody, or Kris Jenkins. Not to mention that the guys track record after we fired Mangini was absolute dogshit. Letting go of Cotchery in favor of Plaxico Burress/Derrick Mason? Giving Sanchez a big extension after a season in which he turned the ball over a league high 28 times? Paying Santonio Holmes over $10 million a year? Trading a 4th round pick for Tebow and bringing the circus to town when your trusted head of scouting was banging the table for Russell Wilson? The guy was a fucking mo-mo and I wish Miami all the worst. I think it was actually a 6th rounder as well.
|
|
|
Post by Sonny Werblin on Jan 8, 2015 14:10:32 GMT -5
Letting go of Cotchery in favor of Plaxico Burress/Derrick Mason? It still pisses me off that we let Cotch go. As I remember Rex pretty much ran him out of town. I think every WR the Jets had at the time is out of football -- Mason, Burress, and Holmes. While Cotch is on another playoff team playing an important role as a reliable veteran target who can be counted on in crunch time. In the 4 years since he left the Jets he has 127 catches for 1624 yards, 12.8 ypc, 13 TDs, and 91 first downs. The Jets could certainly have used a guy like him over the past 4 seasons.
|
|