|
Post by Jet Nut Sauce on Feb 24, 2015 17:04:05 GMT -5
I'm saying you have to look at everything the player has on his resume. Not just how many picks he's thrown
|
|
|
Post by choon328 on Feb 24, 2015 17:08:08 GMT -5
I think it was McShay who said he's giving Winston his 2nd highest grade on a QB in the past 10 years only behind Luck. Winston is clearly the more polished QB at this point. If he didn't have off the field history he would be the no brainer #1 pick. Mariota is a project as a QB and he'll need 2-3 years to develop. He hasn't taken snaps from center and he has poor progression skills b/c Oregon is a 1 read system, unless things breakdown then WR's scatter and get wide open for him down the field. I don't think Winston and Mariota are in the same ball park as far as NFL ready QB's go.
|
|
|
Post by southside on Feb 24, 2015 17:11:28 GMT -5
I'm saying you have to look at everything the player has on his resume. Not just how many picks he's thrown Yeah but I'm saying that the INT stat can and should be a defining stat just like TD passes should be. The shouldn't be the only thing to look at, but when they are really bad that should be a GIANT red flag. Serious question, what is it about Geno Smith that you dislike the most?
|
|
|
Post by choon328 on Feb 24, 2015 17:11:59 GMT -5
Peyton Manning had 23 combined int's his Junior and senior season. Eli Manning 25 ints over those same years. It means absolutely nothing. Winston is the most pro ready QB prospect since Luck. Pro system, pro reads, pro progressions. His learning curve is light years ahead of Mariota.
|
|
|
Post by Hollywood Nosebleed on Feb 24, 2015 17:12:45 GMT -5
And he threw 28 INTs in two seasons. And Mariota has fumbling problems. Lord knows we love drafting QBs that love to put the ball on the ground. Meanwhile Winston only fumbled 6 times last year and lost 2 of them. Personally I feel that Winston's INTs are fixable. He's can make all the throws unlike Mariota and has great touch. If we gambled on one of them I'd rather take Winston. With that said I hope both of them are drafted before our pick so we can take the best WR or Fowler.
|
|
|
Post by Hollywood Nosebleed on Feb 24, 2015 17:16:30 GMT -5
Yeah but I'm saying that the INT stat can and should be a defining stat just like TD passes should be. The shouldn't be the only thing to look at, but when they are really bad that should be a GIANT red flag. Serious question, what is it about Geno Smith that you dislike the most? Geno Smith threw 42 TDs and only 6 INTs his senior year. In college TDs and INTs can be super inflated depending on the type of offense the QB is asked to run. The fact that Winston has succeeded in a pro offense is a huge plus. Put Mariota on FSU and his TDs would go down and his INTs would go up.
|
|
|
Post by Jet Nut Sauce on Feb 24, 2015 17:18:25 GMT -5
I'm saying you have to look at everything the player has on his resume. Not just how many picks he's thrown Yeah but I'm saying that the INT stat can and should be a defining stat just like TD passes should be. The shouldn't be the only thing to look at, but when they are really bad that should be a GIANT red flag. Serious question, what is it about Geno Smith that you dislike the most? Geno hardly threw picks in college. Means little, it's football smarts that ultimately comes into play and hes being called the smartest football player, the most football sense since Manning. He'll have to protect the ball more as a pro, he talked about it the other day. It's just not a GIANT red flag for anyone.
|
|
|
Post by southside on Feb 24, 2015 17:37:09 GMT -5
I think it was McShay who said he's giving Winston his 2nd highest grade on a QB in the past 10 years only behind Luck. Winston is clearly the more polished QB at this point. If he didn't have off the field history he would be the no brainer #1 pick. Mariota is a project as a QB and he'll need 2-3 years to develop. He hasn't taken snaps from center and he has poor progression skills b/c Oregon is a 1 read system, unless things breakdown then WR's scatter and get wide open for him down the field. I don't think Winston and Mariota are in the same ball park as far as NFL ready QB's go. Not bad for a prediction I must say. Even still, I think he's more interested in covering his previous predictions of draft status rather than what the player will actually turn out to be. I think he's full of shit because does anyone really believe he's been a better college QB than Cam Newton or RGIII? Or even Matt Ryan, Matthew Stafford, Joe Flacco? He might be the most hyped but if he's saying that it's his highest rated QB in the last 10 years not named Andrew Luck then I'd say he's being a bit hyperbolic. And it's convenient to say considering that the QB class of the last 10 years has been less than inspiring. And of course, he stops at 10 years ago quite conveniently.... so he could say that he had Aaron Rodgers rated higher than Winston... which I believe is also bullshit because no one thought Aaron Rodgers would be the QB he is today other wise he wouldn't have fallen to the bottom of the 1st round and if he thought so he'd have put him he wouldn't have suggested that the 49ers not take him 1st overall but instead trade out of the pick. So lets take McShay's opinion at face value here.
|
|
|
Post by southside on Feb 24, 2015 17:42:36 GMT -5
I don't think you guys get my position. I really don't want either of these QBs. If I were to chose I'd pick Mariota because he at least can scramble really well and play in an offense that is proven to be a Pro Style offense now with Chip Kelly.... see how that works? Haha.
Neither one of these guys are the QBs you would call franchise. I'll give Winston the nod for the pro system and going through progressions. That's great. But how you can't be concerned about the interceptions when he's going into a bigger, better, and faster paced league... I can only see that propensity to throw interceptions and force the ball down the field to increase. I could be wrong. The good news is that we won't have to worry about it because the Bucs have to pick him or they'll be severely scrutinized.
|
|
|
Post by southside on Feb 24, 2015 17:45:21 GMT -5
And honestly, I can't imagine any Jets fan not to be concerned about QBs that throw interceptions considering that's been the undoing of our last two drafted QBs. It's literally wrecked our season and has the fans cursing the TV for the last 6 years but hey who cares? Winston will save us. False logic. I'd rather continue trotting Geno out there in hopes that the last two years has been part of his learning progression.
|
|
|
Post by Jet Nut Sauce on Feb 24, 2015 17:45:49 GMT -5
I think it was McShay who said he's giving Winston his 2nd highest grade on a QB in the past 10 years only behind Luck. Winston is clearly the more polished QB at this point. If he didn't have off the field history he would be the no brainer #1 pick. Mariota is a project as a QB and he'll need 2-3 years to develop. He hasn't taken snaps from center and he has poor progression skills b/c Oregon is a 1 read system, unless things breakdown then WR's scatter and get wide open for him down the field. I don't think Winston and Mariota are in the same ball park as far as NFL ready QB's go. Not bad for a prediction I must say. Even still, I think he's more interested in covering his previous predictions of draft status rather than what the player will actually turn out to be. I think he's full of shit because does anyone really believe he's been a better college QB than Cam Newton or RGIII? Or even Matt Ryan, Matthew Stafford, Joe Flacco? He might be the most hyped but if he's saying that it's his highest rated QB in the last 10 years not named Andrew Luck then I'd say he's being a bit hyperbolic. And it's convenient to say considering that the QB class of the last 10 years has been less than inspiring. And of course, he stops at 10 years ago quite conveniently.... so he could say that he had Aaron Rodgers rated higher than Winston... which I believe is also bullshit because no one thought Aaron Rodgers would be the QB he is today other wise he wouldn't have fallen to the bottom of the 1st round and if he thought so he'd have put him he wouldn't have suggested that the 49ers not take him 1st overall but instead trade out of the pick. So lets take McShay's opinion at face value here. His college career, how he looked is better than RGIII etc. Flacco doesn't belong on the list, some called him a reach at 18. But the point is execs and personnel people are talking about him being the smartest football sense wise player since Manning. Not just an ESPN commentator that you keep falling back in as if anyone should put all their eggs in McShays limited basket. Why do you want to argue against his talents? He may fail but you could make these sme arguments about every QB who has ever come out of college
|
|
|
Post by southside on Feb 24, 2015 17:56:26 GMT -5
Not bad for a prediction I must say. Even still, I think he's more interested in covering his previous predictions of draft status rather than what the player will actually turn out to be. I think he's full of shit because does anyone really believe he's been a better college QB than Cam Newton or RGIII? Or even Matt Ryan, Matthew Stafford, Joe Flacco? He might be the most hyped but if he's saying that it's his highest rated QB in the last 10 years not named Andrew Luck then I'd say he's being a bit hyperbolic. And it's convenient to say considering that the QB class of the last 10 years has been less than inspiring. And of course, he stops at 10 years ago quite conveniently.... so he could say that he had Aaron Rodgers rated higher than Winston... which I believe is also bullshit because no one thought Aaron Rodgers would be the QB he is today other wise he wouldn't have fallen to the bottom of the 1st round and if he thought so he'd have put him he wouldn't have suggested that the 49ers not take him 1st overall but instead trade out of the pick. So lets take McShay's opinion at face value here. His college career, how he looked is better than RGIII etc. Flacco doesn't belong on the list, some called him a reach at 18. But the point is execs and personnel people are talking about him being the smartest football sense wise player since Mr. Forehead. Not just an ESPN commentator that you keep falling back in as if anyone should put all their eggs in McShays limited basket. Why do you want to argue against his talents? He may fail but you could make these sme arguments about every QB who has ever come out of college Because I don't think he's as good as everyone is making him out to be. That's why. And I think he's full of shit and a terrible person who's been forced to pretend to be something he isn't since he nearly derailed his career before it even began. He's a phony. And the last thing I want to see is this guy wearing the green and white while throwing into triple coverage and shit tons of interceptions. I will agree that he looks like a good passer but I also don't like QBs with the elongated baseball mechanics either. And if you're telling me that if Matt Ryan, even knowing what he is now which I think is equal or less than what people thought he would be, was in this draft I'd take him over Winston as well and so would a lot of people. I don't care what McShay or Kiper say. They are both full of shit anyway. They know as much as anyone else except they are getting paid to do it. They both whiff on talent and completely omit other highly successful players. However, I can be quoted somewhere here today as saying that if MacDaddy believes in him then I'd roll with it since he is considered a good scout. It's all moot regardless because he's not falling from #1 unless he does something AMAZINGLY stupid and we're not trading up to get him either.
|
|
|
Post by DowNY on Feb 24, 2015 19:32:19 GMT -5
You do realize we're not going to the Super Bowl next season right? Especially not with a rookie QB from this class. Better off waiting. I'd throw a 4th at the Rams for Bradford and see what's up with that. Just to screw Rex's pursuit of him. With that said. If one of these guys are at #6 then you take them. So...out of the 32 teams, which ones are planning on trying to make it to the Superbowl? How does not planning on trying to win translate to coaching? How soon in training camp does the coach announce to the team that they suck and will be watching the playoffs from home? Who knows. All 32 teams have the common goal of winning the Super Bowl. Some planning for next season & some are slowly building & know it's best to tank another season probably. We'll never know what all 32 front office plans are. Sorry. Lol
|
|
|
Post by Hotman on Feb 25, 2015 12:31:04 GMT -5
Don't want.
|
|
|
Post by sec.101row23 on Feb 25, 2015 12:51:03 GMT -5
Not bad for a prediction I must say. Even still, I think he's more interested in covering his previous predictions of draft status rather than what the player will actually turn out to be. I think he's full of shit because does anyone really believe he's been a better college QB than Cam Newton or RGIII? Or even Matt Ryan, Matthew Stafford, Joe Flacco? He might be the most hyped but if he's saying that it's his highest rated QB in the last 10 years not named Andrew Luck then I'd say he's being a bit hyperbolic. And it's convenient to say considering that the QB class of the last 10 years has been less than inspiring. And of course, he stops at 10 years ago quite conveniently.... so he could say that he had Aaron Rodgers rated higher than Winston... which I believe is also bullshit because no one thought Aaron Rodgers would be the QB he is today other wise he wouldn't have fallen to the bottom of the 1st round and if he thought so he'd have put him he wouldn't have suggested that the 49ers not take him 1st overall but instead trade out of the pick. So lets take McShay's opinion at face value here. His college career, how he looked is better than RGIII etc. Flacco doesn't belong on the list, some called him a reach at 18. But the point is execs and personnel people are talking about him being the smartest football sense wise player since Mr. Forehead. Not just an ESPN commentator that you keep falling back in as if anyone should put all their eggs in McShays limited basket. Why do you want to argue against his talents? He may fail but you could make these sme arguments about every QB who has ever come out of college You are correct, he is a better prospect than RGIII was. Plus Winston is just in his infancy in his development. He is 20 years old and only has two seasons as a starter. He is a natural thrower, has the ability to improvise on different throws and has an above average football IQ. There is nothing wrong with his delivery, his release times are more than adequate.
|
|