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Post by rexneffect on Dec 12, 2014 11:22:11 GMT -5
I think the big issue is if it does actually help in intelligence gathering, which was the point of it in the first place - I strongly doubt it does or did. Frankly I think if 99% of us were tortured by the methods describe in this report, we'd say just about anything to make it stop, fact or fiction. Basically I just don't think it works - and if you are using it as a means of punishment, frankly you aren't much better than a group like ISIS. that's leftist propaganda: it does work Source? All the reports from military and intelligence sources suggest the valuable info they obtained was either from captured combatants pre-torture or other sources. |
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Post by Can'tGetEnoughJizzInMyMouth on Dec 12, 2014 11:38:15 GMT -5
that's leftist propaganda: it does work I believe the CIA director said yesterday its "unknowable" whether any information obtained was helpful. You're wrong... Try a credible source for your information.. |
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Post by The Tax Returns Are in Kenya on Dec 12, 2014 12:46:12 GMT -5
Arms pulled out of sockets is torture... Bamboo splints under fingernails is torture.... A wet towel on your face and water up your nose is not torture... It may be a bit uncomfortable but it isn't torture... These filthy unwashed head chopping savages should have experienced real torture..... STFU! Stop dissing the CIA! They do too know how to properly torture people! ETA:  |
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Post by Ff2 on Dec 12, 2014 12:48:24 GMT -5
I believe the CIA director said yesterday its "unknowable" whether any information obtained was helpful. You're wrong... Try a credible source for your information.. AP good enough? WASHINGTON (AP) — CIA Director John Brennan is acknowledging that agency officers did "abhorrent" things to captive terror suspects, and he says he can't prove the harsh treatment made the prisoners cooperate. But he defends the overall post-9/11 interrogation program for stopping attacks and saving lives. That is the carefully balanced case that Brennan attempted to make Thursday during an unprecedented televised news conference at CIA headquarters, something no one on the CIA public affairs staff could remember ever happening at the secretive agency's Virginia campus. At the heart of Brennan's remarks was an exquisitely nuanced argument: That while today's CIA takes no position on whether the brutal interrogation tactics themselves led detainees to cooperate, there is no doubt that detainees subjected to the treatment offered "useful and valuable" information afterward. Brennan said it was "unknown and unknowable" whether the harsh treatment yielded crucial intelligence that could have been gained in any other way. |
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Post by The Tax Returns Are in Kenya on Dec 12, 2014 13:03:13 GMT -5
You're wrong... Try a credible source for your information.. AP good enough? WASHINGTON (AP) — CIA Director John Brennan is acknowledging that agency officers did "abhorrent" things to captive terror suspects, and he says he can't prove the harsh treatment made the prisoners cooperate. But he defends the overall post-9/11 interrogation program for stopping attacks and saving lives. That is the carefully balanced case that Brennan attempted to make Thursday during an unprecedented televised news conference at CIA headquarters, something no one on the CIA public affairs staff could remember ever happening at the secretive agency's Virginia campus. At the heart of Brennan's remarks was an exquisitely nuanced argument: That while today's CIA takes no position on whether the brutal interrogation tactics themselves led detainees to cooperate, there is no doubt that detainees subjected to the treatment offered "useful and valuable" information afterward. Brennan said it was "unknown and unknowable" whether the harsh treatment yielded crucial intelligence that could have been gained in any other way.Oldest diversion in the book - source not credible, source not credible. LOL@ CIA Director himself not being a credible enough source |
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Post by BEAC0NJET on Dec 12, 2014 13:31:06 GMT -5
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Post by BEAC0NJET on Dec 12, 2014 13:34:28 GMT -5
You're wrong... Try a credible source for your information.. AP good enough? WASHINGTON (AP) — CIA Director John Brennan is acknowledging that agency officers did "abhorrent" things to captive terror suspects, and he says he can't prove the harsh treatment made the prisoners cooperate. But he defends the overall post-9/11 interrogation program for stopping attacks and saving lives. That is the carefully balanced case that Brennan attempted to make Thursday during an unprecedented televised news conference at CIA headquarters, something no one on the CIA public affairs staff could remember ever happening at the secretive agency's Virginia campus. At the heart of Brennan's remarks was an exquisitely nuanced argument: That while today's CIA takes no position on whether the brutal interrogation tactics themselves led detainees to cooperate, there is no doubt that detainees subjected to the treatment offered "useful and valuable" information afterward. Brennan said it was "unknown and unknowable" whether the harsh treatment yielded crucial intelligence that could have been gained in any other way.I will say we should also focus on the statement prior along with the bolded part, in that hes saying IMO that the interrogation did provide useful information but that its unknown if that same information could be gained without these tactics. They say nuanced... I probably have other words for it. |
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Post by Can'tGetEnoughJizzInMyMouth on Dec 12, 2014 15:21:09 GMT -5
You're wrong... Try a credible source for your information.. AP good enough? WASHINGTON (AP) — CIA Director John Brennan is acknowledging that agency officers did "abhorrent" things to captive terror suspects, and he says he can't prove the harsh treatment made the prisoners cooperate. But he defends the overall post-9/11 interrogation program for stopping attacks and saving lives. That is the carefully balanced case that Brennan attempted to make Thursday during an unprecedented televised news conference at CIA headquarters, something no one on the CIA public affairs staff could remember ever happening at the secretive agency's Virginia campus. At the heart of Brennan's remarks was an exquisitely nuanced argument: That while today's CIA takes no position on whether the brutal interrogation tactics themselves led detainees to cooperate, there is no doubt that detainees subjected to the treatment offered "useful and valuable" information afterward. Brennan said it was "unknown and unknowable" whether the harsh treatment yielded crucial intelligence that could have been gained in any other way.Washington (CNN) -- CIA Director John Brennan on Thursday defended harsh interrogation techniques as providing "useful" information to authorities, including in the raid that led to the death of Osama bin Laden. |
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Post by Bavarian on Dec 12, 2014 16:25:18 GMT -5
TBH I don't really feel bad at all about the alledged 'torture'. Let's see, your country men just killed 3000 of our citizens, and you're likely involved, so yes, I'm going to hurt you. I mean, what does the media want us to do? Capture these guys and give them milk and cookies? Fuck them. As them questions then just put a bullet in their head next time. You can't win a war without being violent. Somewhere along the line, this country has lost its desire to let loose unabashed violence against its enemies. Yeah, this represents most of America. Those dreaded "terrorists" have a way of frightening the population into having no issue with the ends justifying the means. Unfortunately, this has led to serious degradation of our civil liberties which continue to be abused.
Meanwhile, senseless slaughter continues in Afghanistan amongst millions of those who have no earthly idea why Americans are killing them.
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Post by Bavarian on Dec 12, 2014 16:28:46 GMT -5
ISIS may be the best thing that could of happened when it comes to war on terrorism. ISIS is the closest thing we have to a Identifiable organization with any type of uniformity not just a ideology. Or simply a prop used to stir up fears among Americans to justify more buildup in that region. Nothing like some staged beheadings to get rile up the malaise. There are defense contracts that need to be awarded to rescue our country from evil terrorists over the ocean. |
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Post by PK on Dec 12, 2014 16:31:28 GMT -5
TBH I don't really feel bad at all about the alledged 'torture'. Let's see, your country men just killed 3000 of our citizens, and you're likely involved, so yes, I'm going to hurt you. I mean, what does the media want us to do? Capture these guys and give them milk and cookies? Fuck them. As them questions then just put a bullet in their head next time. You can't win a war without being violent. Somewhere along the line, this country has lost its desire to let loose unabashed violence against its enemies. Yeah, this represents most of America. Those dreaded "terrorists" have a way of frightening the population into having no issue with the ends justifying the means. Unfortunately, this has led to serious degradation of our civil liberties which continue to be abused.
Meanwhile, senseless slaughter continues in Afghanistan amongst millions of those who have no earthly idea why Americans are killing them.
You'd have to be living under a rock if you don't know why were bombi...... ..... ..oh. Right. I guess they wouldn't have any idea.... |
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Post by PK on Dec 12, 2014 16:32:07 GMT -5
ISIS may be the best thing that could of happened when it comes to war on terrorism. ISIS is the closest thing we have to a Identifiable organization with any type of uniformity not just a ideology. Or simply a prop used to stir up fears among Americans to justify more buildup in that region. Nothing like some staged beheadings to get rile up the malaise. There are defense contracts that need to be awarded to rescue our country from evil terrorists over the ocean. Staged beheadings? You gotta elaborate on that one.... |
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Post by Bavarian on Dec 12, 2014 16:32:28 GMT -5
AP good enough? WASHINGTON (AP) — CIA Director John Brennan is acknowledging that agency officers did "abhorrent" things to captive terror suspects, and he says he can't prove the harsh treatment made the prisoners cooperate. But he defends the overall post-9/11 interrogation program for stopping attacks and saving lives. That is the carefully balanced case that Brennan attempted to make Thursday during an unprecedented televised news conference at CIA headquarters, something no one on the CIA public affairs staff could remember ever happening at the secretive agency's Virginia campus. At the heart of Brennan's remarks was an exquisitely nuanced argument: That while today's CIA takes no position on whether the brutal interrogation tactics themselves led detainees to cooperate, there is no doubt that detainees subjected to the treatment offered "useful and valuable" information afterward. Brennan said it was "unknown and unknowable" whether the harsh treatment yielded crucial intelligence that could have been gained in any other way.Washington (CNN) -- CIA Director John Brennan on Thursday defended harsh interrogation techniques as providing "useful" information to authorities, including in the raid that led to the death of Osama bin Laden. I haven't been following this story very closely - could anyone tell me why this is news over 10 years later? Don't we have an oversight committee in the house and senate? Is the CIA withholding info from them like NSA has? Or must we wait until the freedom of information expiration takes hold before we learn anything. Feel free to enlighten me if I'm speaking out of turn here as I fully admit I'm not aware of all the details here. Thanks.
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Post by Bavarian on Dec 12, 2014 16:36:34 GMT -5
AP good enough? WASHINGTON (AP) — CIA Director John Brennan is acknowledging that agency officers did "abhorrent" things to captive terror suspects, and he says he can't prove the harsh treatment made the prisoners cooperate. But he defends the overall post-9/11 interrogation program for stopping attacks and saving lives. That is the carefully balanced case that Brennan attempted to make Thursday during an unprecedented televised news conference at CIA headquarters, something no one on the CIA public affairs staff could remember ever happening at the secretive agency's Virginia campus. At the heart of Brennan's remarks was an exquisitely nuanced argument: That while today's CIA takes no position on whether the brutal interrogation tactics themselves led detainees to cooperate, there is no doubt that detainees subjected to the treatment offered "useful and valuable" information afterward. Brennan said it was "unknown and unknowable" whether the harsh treatment yielded crucial intelligence that could have been gained in any other way.Oldest diversion in the book - source not credible, source not credible. LOL@ CIA Director himself not being a credible enough source I find it ridiculous to believe an intelligence agency can't "know" results of what it conducted less than 10 years ago. I understand it wasn't on his watch but it's not even reality what he says. Typical. And no outrage will be shown from congress. |
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Post by flushingjet on Dec 12, 2014 17:55:10 GMT -5
1st... these folks werent lawful combatants and arent legally entitled to protections but mcveigh types, when and where they exist need to be thrashed mercilessly also
2nd... we got plenty o' info. How we get OBL and stop other plots?....how.
the very blue LA Times:....http://articles.latimes.com/2011/may/02/news/la-pn-osama-bin-laden-cia-20110502
A (D) controlled Senate on the way out or a latterday CIA figurehead (who was not in the CIA) is not going to say otherwise. Bob Kerrey (D) said it was crap, no one was interviewed, no recommendations
3rd to liberals/libertarians (social tenet-wise, indistinguishable from each other) the "freedom"
"lost" (that you haven't any more than a red light camera strips you of human dignity)
is but a small tradeoff for the avoidance of getting blown up-we had to do it because you
wouldnt coordinate intellligence efforts -stop coddling the sociopaths
everytime we try living the lib/libertarian way innocent people get killed-unborn babies, civilians
having had a very close call on 9/11 once in a lifetime is more than enough for me
ill be eternally glad for our govt to go up a nose with a rubber hose
or electrocute, bomb, eviscerate mortal enemies in perpetuity on my behalf if you dont
in an us vs them battle, when you side with them you are them-why u want to be wit' them?
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